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Breastfeeding mother imprisoned


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#1 verde

Posted 30 September 2017 - 07:57 PM

How can this happen? What can women who are breastfeeding or have breastfed do to prevent this happening again?

https://www.theguard...-pays-3000-fine

#2 seayork2002

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:01 PM

Why does breastfeeding allow someone off a crime/penalty?

#3 Paddlepop

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:05 PM

Child is 2yo so he/she wouldn't be reliant on the mum as the primary source of nutrition. The mum is being released tomorrow anyway.

#4 Mooples

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:06 PM

View Postverde, on 30 September 2017 - 07:57 PM, said:


What can women who are breastfeeding or have breastfed do to prevent this happening again?


Not commit a crime? Seems the logical solution.

#5 petit_manchot

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:07 PM

Hmmm, I'm with previous posters on this. While I agree with the point made in the article that jailing people for not paying fines is part of a bigger problem in these communities, I'm not sure that the breastfeeding argument is particularly relevant in this case.

#6 Teds

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:07 PM

Why does being poor mean people have to go to jail? If this was me, I'd have the resources to pay the fine. Part of the systemic discrimination against certain sectors of our society, and partly why so many aboriginal people end up in jail for really dumb reasons.

#7 Lallalla

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:08 PM

On the one hand I agree with Seayork, the best way to avoid going to jail as a breast feeding mother is to not commit a crime.

On the other hand separating a homeless mum and her breast feeding baby (plus 4 older children) over unpaid fines seems a bit rich.

On a third hand (?), the baby was 2 years old, I wonder if it would have happened if the baby had been tiny (and therefore breast milk it's primary/only food source).

#8 Kallie88

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:09 PM

I think you're conflating issues. If she had paid her fine she would not have been separated from her children. If she had committed a murder would it be equally abhorrent that she was in jail instead of at home breastfeeding?  Or would you say it was the accepted consequence for committing a crime? Jail may be a harsh penalty for unpaid fines, but that is an issue all to itself, breastfeeding or not should play no part in that discussion.

#9 Hands Up

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:09 PM

Child is two. Breastfeeding is not a medical necessity. Vast majority of children no longer being fed at this age. The bigger issue is how aboriginal women are disproportionately affected by jailing for non payment of fines. The Senator's suggestion of collection via deductions from Centrelink payments seems much fairer.

#10 halcyondays

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:09 PM

So no one sees a problem with an aboriginal woman being taken away from her young children because of about $4000 in unpaid fines over a court case involving an unregistered dog? An aboriginal person in poverty without the means to pay these fines?
I'm sure she and her family remember the stolen generation all too well.

#11 born.a.girl

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:10 PM

View PostMooples, on 30 September 2017 - 08:06 PM, said:

Not commit a crime? Seems the logical solution.

It was a fine over an unregistered dog, which seemingly dragged on and turned into a massive amount of money.


I can't see the logic of jail under those circumstances. Surely community service is better for everyone involved.

A two year old would hopefully be receiving virtually all of its sustenance elsewhere, but a sudden disruption in their routine and their comforting rituals would be hard.

#12 petit_manchot

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:15 PM

View Posthalcyondays, on 30 September 2017 - 08:09 PM, said:

So no one sees a problem with an aboriginal woman being taken away from her young children because of about $4000 in unpaid fines over a court case involving an unregistered dog? An aboriginal person in poverty without the means to pay these fines?
I'm sure she and her family remember the stolen generation all too well.

I do think there are serious issues with the punishment attached to non-payment of the fine.

I don't think that the fact that the woman is/was breastfeeding a 2-year old is related to this much broader systemic problem. There are other valid arguments that can be made, that do not take away from the injustice of this woman's predicament, and that have more substance than 'but she is breastfeeding'.

#13 Mooples

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:16 PM

View Postborn.a.girl, on 30 September 2017 - 08:10 PM, said:



It was a fine over an unregistered dog, which seemingly dragged on and turned into a massive amount of money.


I can't see the logic of jail under those circumstances. Surely community service is better for everyone involved.

A two year old would hopefully be receiving virtually all of its sustenance elsewhere, but a sudden disruption in their routine and their comforting rituals would be hard.

I agree the penalty is harsh and the treatment of Indigenous people is horrible but she should have registered her dog. An extremely minor crime of course but so easily avoided.

#14 purplekitty

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:19 PM

I'd rather Belle Gibson was in jail for not ponying up the $400,000.

#15 ~J_F~

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:23 PM

The simplistic answer is to say not get fined in the first place and if you do pay the fines.

But the makes it an incredibly black and white issue and it just isnt.

Considering that Aboriginal people are only 3% of Australia's population and in some areas of the country they make up at least 80% of the prison population. Something isnt right.

#16 Lucrezia Borgia

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:25 PM

View PostTeds, on 30 September 2017 - 08:07 PM, said:

Why does being poor mean people have to go to jail? If this was me, I'd have the resources to pay the fine. Part of the systemic discrimination against certain sectors of our society, and partly why so many aboriginal people end up in jail for really dumb reasons.

This.



#17 ~Kestrel~

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:26 PM

Breastfeeding or not, it is wrong for a two year old to be forcibly separated from their primary caregiver without a very good reason.

#18 Oriental lily

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:30 PM

Just another bit of evidence that financial hardhip as punishment is unfair and does not work ! Whatever her original 'crime' was has snowballed In to this ridiculous penalty and caused hardhip for many people . Over an unregistered dog????  Belle Gibson swindled hundreds of thousands of dollars through deceit , fraud and lies ! .never had to see the inside of a courtroom! Snubbed her nose the whole time at the justice system . The judge even kindly said she might have a mental health problem and the fine can be payed instalments . Yet this indigenous woman is incarcerated , seperated from her family , all because she is incapable of paying a much smaller fine ? Were was the compassion for her? Something seriously screwed up in his these different 'punishments' have been handled !

#19 verde

Posted 30 September 2017 - 08:43 PM

I suppose that means i don't really understand what a crime is. To me, separating a mother from a child is a crime. A civil matter involving a municipal fine can be considered a crime?

#20 purplekitty

Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:02 PM

There was another Aboriginal death in custody last week.
A young man of 22.

That is also one of the implications of locking up people up that needs to be considered.

#21 ~J_F~

Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:10 PM

We have Murri Court in Qld. I dont know if other states have this or something similar.

It tries to work the Indigenous cultural side with the law side and find a middle ground to deal with certain crimes.

An Aboriginal elder sits on the bench with the Magistrate and helps advise them in what will best help the particular person.

#22 Ellie bean

Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:10 PM

Yes imprisonment in this case is appalling. nothing to do with breastfeeding- I'm failing to see how it would be any better if she wasn't bf.

#23 FuzzyChocolateToes

Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:29 PM

The punishment doesn’t fit the crime - prison for an unregistered dog seems extremely heavy handed.

#24 lucky 2

Posted 30 September 2017 - 09:54 PM

Considering they are homeless it would be wise to continue to allow a very young child like this 2yo to have access to the breast when needed or wanted.
.
Supporting the immune system, providing comfort and security in what sounds like difficult living conditions sounds sensible.
It's bad enough separating a child from their comfort toy when it's left at Grandma's or daycare, we tend to think the world might end for the child, let alone loss of everything, mum, mum's arms, mum's breasts etc.
It's a no win situation for any child, bf or not.

#25 Feral Grey Mare

Posted 30 September 2017 - 10:18 PM

The cost of trying her and jailing her would have been way more than the amount of the fines. Surely a small deduction from her benefit payment would have made more sense.




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