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Is green poos mandatory for a allergy/intolerance?


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#26 AdelTwins

Posted 04 March 2019 - 10:07 AM

That looks exactly like DS3’s nappies. He has food intolerances and was diagnosed as failure to thrive. Basically his gut was so damaged and there was lots of bleeding/mucus.

Drs will often tell you it’s most likely a dairy intolerance, as that is the most common one. But kids can also be intolerant to wheat, nuts, seafoood, etc. The list is huge!
I tried a very strict diet and it didn’t help DS3. I was expressing and dumping the milk into the hope that he would breastfeed again. In the end, he ended up on Aptimal Pepti Junior. My paed was able to get it on prescription for me so the cost was greatly reduced.

I was also referred to a Dr who specializes in allergies who wasn’t able to help me as intolerances are much harder to diagnose as there is no immediate response as with allergies (especially when transmitted through breast milk). My strict diet didn’t help and in the end we kept him on the formula and introduced foods very slowly (2 per week) at 5m.

He’s 18m now and very tall, meeting all his milestones, etc. We have 2 uncommon intolerances (so far). He eats a healthy and varied diet.

Good luck. Please PM me if you would like any more info.

#27 Wonderstruck

Posted 05 March 2019 - 07:12 AM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 04 March 2019 - 09:46 AM, said:

So we decided to try Aptamil Allerpro since my wife can no longer handle dieting and everytime he screams she thinks its something she's eaten.

He was great in the last 24 hours ... now he's refusing to eat and seems constipated. He has done this before when we've tried formulas (although they where not HA)

He's now only had 230ml in the last 12 hours ...

Do we just continue until he manages to poo ... he seems so distressed. I feel like we've stuffed his gut up trying so many different things but he needs consistency with what he's eating.

Sometimes they find the formula taste hard to adjust to. You could try adding some maple syrup or vanilla.

Constipation can occur when you trial something new. We used coloxyl until our paed gastro got us onto osmolax but I'm not sure of the dosage for a young baby.

I cant remember if you have appointments lined up with a paed gastro or dietitian etc? You need someone who can prescribe neocate or similar if needed and to guide you through this.

Hows it going with the allepro?

#28 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 05 March 2019 - 07:59 AM

View PostWonderstruck, on 05 March 2019 - 07:12 AM, said:

Sometimes they find the formula taste hard to adjust to. You could try adding some maple syrup or vanilla.

Constipation can occur when you trial something new. We used coloxyl until our paed gastro got us onto osmolax but I'm not sure of the dosage for a young baby.

I cant remember if you have appointments lined up with a paed gastro or dietitian etc? You need someone who can prescribe neocate or similar if needed and to guide you through this.

Hows it going with the allepro?

Hi, we have a paed appointment this friday. The allerpro we think seem's to be going well he's WAY less gassy. Sleeping better and seems overall a little better but he's just eating less. Like struggling to get him to eat more than 90ml or so per feed and 600ml a day.

He only gained 30grams last week which is part of the reason we swapped to allerpro as well as his mucusy poos of course but yeah we are worried he's just not eating enough.

Edit- forgot to mention he's definitely not constipated, did a poo last night and it looked quite good. Much less mucus then my other pics

https://imgur.com/a/9RL7Wqw

Edited by Davidoff-sensei, 05 March 2019 - 08:28 AM.


#29 Wonderstruck

Posted 05 March 2019 - 03:51 PM

That's great new. Keep at it till you see the paed. The taste can be a but tricky for them to get used to but they usually do.

#30 Ellie bean

Posted 05 March 2019 - 03:57 PM

Good luck with the paed. I’m glad to hear there doesn’t seem to be constipation. I hope things improve/ keep improving

#31 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 06 March 2019 - 07:24 AM

View PostWonderstruck, on 05 March 2019 - 03:51 PM, said:

That's great new. Keep at it till you see the paed. The taste can be a but tricky for them to get used to but they usually do.

We are definitely having taste issues. Last night he rejected even having ANY allerpro ... couldn't get 1ml down him. Then we tried breastmilk and he had 150ml ....

After some searching i've seen some people say there paediatricians said to try a small amount of maple syrup and slowly wean off needing it. Will ask my ped on friday but in the meantime we can't get him to eat any now.

#32 Ellie bean

Posted 06 March 2019 - 03:31 PM

I’ve heard of people using vanilla too- I think getting the paeds opinion is a good idea. Good luck and let us know how you go

#33 Wonderstruck

Posted 06 March 2019 - 07:30 PM

Yep maple syrup or vanilla are commonly used. Some people start with a small amount of formula mixed with EBM and gradually increase.

Good luck with the paed :)

#34 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 08 March 2019 - 12:48 PM

Ok So paediatrician appointment went well. He has given us a script for Pepti Jnr since he's shown improvements on allerpro.

He has started taking the allerpro better with the syrup ... getting around 600-650ml in him a day now.

From what i can tell the pepti jnr is the same level of hydrolysed as allerpro it just has no lactose and special fats for malabsorption ... i mean he has huge gas issues and sometimes explosive poos so maybe he has some kind of lactose issue but nothing confirmed. I've read its bad to give lactose free formula to a baby who is not lactose intolerent? ...

#35 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 10 March 2019 - 05:17 PM

Poo pic from all allerpro since i cant get him to take pepti.

No idea how to tell if it has mucus or not still?

When you join the folds in the nappy and open it it has parts that stick to each other but not sure if its mucus.

https://imgur.com/a/BfUMUCf

#36 Sincerely

Posted 11 March 2019 - 07:36 AM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 08 March 2019 - 12:48 PM, said:

Ok So paediatrician appointment went well. He has given us a script for Pepti Jnr since he's shown improvements on allerpro.

He has started taking the allerpro better with the syrup ... getting around 600-650ml in him a day now.

From what i can tell the pepti jnr is the same level of hydrolysed as allerpro it just has no lactose and special fats for malabsorption ... i mean he has huge gas issues and sometimes explosive poos so maybe he has some kind of lactose issue but nothing confirmed. I've read its bad to give lactose free formula to a baby who is not lactose intolerent? ...

Lactose intolerance can be diagnosed by looking for reducing substances (sugars) in the stool. In your DB's case, if he has/had intestinal inflammation from allergy to milk proteins, there might still be nonspecific, resolving malabsorption, including of lactose. Therefore, the absence of faecal reducing substances would exclude lactose intolerance, but the presence of reducing substances should be followed up with another sample in 2-3 weeks to determine if the first was due to nonspecific malabsorption or an actual underlying lactose intolerance.

If your GP or paed decides such a test is indicated, your DB would need to have had milk feeds (as opposed to lactose free formula) in the preceding 24 hrs. The test only requires a small amount of stool sample, collected in a sterile container (such as a urine test collection jar), but must be kept frozen until testing (otherwise bacteria in the sample will break down the lactose).

The only down side I can think of with giving a lactose-free but otherwise completely nutritional formula to an infant who is not lactose intolerant is that they will downregulate their lactase enzyme production and might become intolerant of large amounts of lactose, much the same way Asian & African populations can all drink breast milk and lactose formulas as babies but don't tolerate dairy products (cheeses, ice cream etc) well after early childhood, due to genetically determined downregulation of their enzyme levels.

#37 Ellie bean

Posted 11 March 2019 - 10:20 PM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 10 March 2019 - 05:17 PM, said:

Poo pic from all allerpro since i cant get him to take pepti.

No idea how to tell if it has mucus or not still?

When you join the folds in the nappy and open it it has parts that stick to each other but not sure if its mucus.

https://imgur.com/a/BfUMUCf
Sorry I can’t really tell either. If you have a follow up paed appointment I’d take the photo with you
I hope things are slowly improving for you

#38 Ellie bean

Posted 11 March 2019 - 10:22 PM

I thought the pepti was more hydrolysed but I could be wrong
I’m lucky that mine would drink the pepti so I’m not a lot of help with that sorry

#39 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 12 March 2019 - 09:18 AM

They seemed to be ... but today he seems really refluxy. Its like the formula is to thin, we have tried thickener but he came out in a big rash afterwards so have stopped it.

Today since 12am at night he's only had 140ml is 9.5 hours ... he just wont drink.

#40 Wonderstruck

Posted 12 March 2019 - 05:23 PM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 12 March 2019 - 09:18 AM, said:

They seemed to be ... but today he seems really refluxy. Its like the formula is to thin, we have tried thickener but he came out in a big rash afterwards so have stopped it.

Today since 12am at night he's only had 140ml is 9.5 hours ... he just wont drink.

Sounds like you might need some reflux meds to deal with the reflux.

We were cmpi and reflux and still needed meds for our reflux.

I would see if you can speak to the paed or GP as feed refusal is common in reflux babies.

#41 Ellie bean

Posted 13 March 2019 - 12:59 AM

View PostWonderstruck, on 12 March 2019 - 05:23 PM, said:



Sounds like you might need some reflux meds to deal with the reflux.

We were cmpi and reflux and still needed meds for our reflux.

Yep same here

#42 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 13 March 2019 - 07:08 AM

Yeah i think we will have another visit about that ... he excessively grunts and looks like he's trying to keep stuff down and shows a sour kind of taste response.

Doesn't happen every feed but i'd say most of them.

Also wakes at 3am every single night grunting and rolling around but asleep and sometimes coughs, if you roll him onto his side he instantly stops and stays asleep but if you roll him back onto his back it starts up again instantly .. super weird but feel like there's something annoying him.

#43 Sincerely

Posted 13 March 2019 - 08:36 AM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 13 March 2019 - 07:08 AM, said:

Yeah i think we will have another visit about that ... he excessively grunts and looks like he's trying to keep stuff down and shows a sour kind of taste response.

Doesn't happen every feed but i'd say most of them.

Also wakes at 3am every single night grunting and rolling around but asleep and sometimes coughs, if you roll him onto his side he instantly stops and stays asleep but if you roll him back onto his back it starts up again instantly .. super weird but feel like there's something annoying him.

I'm not sure it's appropriate to give my advice as I am NOT an expert & this is just an anecdote of something I worked out myself:

My younger two had reflux so I put a folded blanket UNDER the mattress (so there was no risk of suffcation from the blanket) at the top end of their cot mattress, so that the mattress was very slightly inclined from head to foot. The rationale was that if the head was above the level of the stomach, gravity would contribute to keeping the gastric contents down and it did seem to help. It was only a very mild incline though, so it wouldn't otherwise affect their comfort and they weren't at risk of somehow rolling down the incline.

#44 Ellie bean

Posted 13 March 2019 - 11:52 AM

Yes we put a foam wedge under the mattress for the same reason

#45 Wonderstruck

Posted 13 March 2019 - 07:34 PM

We used blocks under the cot legs and only used sleeping bags so even if she slid down nothing to get caught under

#46 Emfren

Posted 13 March 2019 - 07:49 PM

We raised the cot at one end slightly too

#47 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 14 March 2019 - 07:32 AM

Yeah we have a co-sleeper bassinet that can be raised at one end which we already do ... still doesn't seem to help.

Our CHN seems to think we need to treat reflux asap as he seems to be developing a feeding aversion?

He is eating less and less each day and starts crying in a feeding position before a feed even starts .... the problems just feel like its never ending.

He slept 8.5 hours last night woke up and had 60ml of formula and then just wont drink anymore ... how is that even possible? He just wont eat, he seems relatively happy when awake and still having wet nappies albeit they aren't super heavy like i've felt before.

Urine is still clear and tears flowing when crying ... weird that im happy about that.

Everything is just so hard .... feel like such failures because we cant even give our baby a bottle. We don't go anywhere because we're terrified of making a "scene" in public.

It's so frustrating because it shouldn't be this hard ... i think we will start up the nexium again. Didn't want him on such a heavy drug but he definitely has some silent reflux and if its stopping him eating then i guess thats worse.

#48 Ellie bean

Posted 14 March 2019 - 08:55 AM

You’re not failures. Looking after a reflux cmpi Bub is incredibly hard, so much harder than a “healthy” baby, I doubt anyone who hasn’t been through it understands. You’re doing a great job and it WILL get easier, yiu just need to take it one day at a time.
I don’t want to speak for your situation but my own babies definitely needed the combo of the hydrolysed formula amd medication. It wasn’t a magic fix but with those 2 things it did slowly get easier.

#49 Wonderstruck

Posted 14 March 2019 - 08:55 AM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 14 March 2019 - 07:32 AM, said:

Yeah we have a co-sleeper bassinet that can be raised at one end which we already do ... still doesn't seem to help.

Our CHN seems to think we need to treat reflux asap as he seems to be developing a feeding aversion?

He is eating less and less each day and starts crying in a feeding position before a feed even starts .... the problems just feel like its never ending.

He slept 8.5 hours last night woke up and had 60ml of formula and then just wont drink anymore ... how is that even possible? He just wont eat, he seems relatively happy when awake and still having wet nappies albeit they aren't super heavy like i've felt before.

Urine is still clear and tears flowing when crying ... weird that im happy about that.

Everything is just so hard .... feel like such failures because we cant even give our baby a bottle. We don't go anywhere because we're terrified of making a "scene" in public.

It's so frustrating because it shouldn't be this hard ... i think we will start up the nexium again. Didn't want him on such a heavy drug but he definitely has some silent reflux and if its stopping him eating then i guess thats worse.

Yes get on top of the reflux asap. My daughter is still on reflux meds at 2 she's a severe case but is thriving and it's so worth it

#50 daisychaon

Posted 15 March 2019 - 10:40 PM

Can I just jump in here and say you are doing brilliantly, to be onto the problem and basically have nailed the diagnoses yourselves, as first time (and I presume non medical) parents, that is just incredible.
My daughter had exactly the same pattern of waking in the early hours, in fact that was here first symptom from about one week of age. It was 4 am and you could set your clock to it. She would writhe, arch and grunt in her sleep and seem so uncomfortable and often have a huge spill at the same time. I googled madly and found some people saying there is a huge “acid dump” in the stomach in the early hours of the morning g that can greatly exacerbate reflux symptoms. She went on to have daytime irritibility and frequent large spills and improved on losec, but then everything seemed to shift to her lower gut and she developed mucus poos and huge amounts of flatulence. Paed wasn’t interested as she was gaining weight well but things intensified greatly when we started solids and she basically stopped sleeping. Eventually got to see a dietitian who confirmed what I’d suspected all along - non-IgE allergy to CMP (and also several other allergens). Your poo pics are identical to those I have of my daughter’s nappies.
It is a nightmare and the amount of misinformation and ignorance in the medical profession makes it that much harder. Sounds like you have a good CAFHs nurse, stick with her. I totally agree you need to aggressively treat the reflux. And if you are still on a partially hydrolysed formula it may not be sufficient and you may need a complete elemental formula- allergy may be grumbling along at a low level. Have you seen a dietitian or allergist yet?
Please don’t despair, it is so hard but it definitely gets better, just try and get some rest somehow yourselves, you are doing amazingly




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