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Is green poos mandatory for a allergy/intolerance?


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#51 daisychaon

Posted 15 March 2019 - 10:48 PM

Ps your allerpro poo pic looks like mucus to me, your description of nappy folds sticking as well as glistening appearance and consistency look like a grumbling allergy to me. I’d get on neocate or similar instead and see if that helps. I would suspect he’s refusing it for a reason...
Just remembered too there is a rice hydrolysate formula available over the counter - that may be worth a try- can’t recall the name sorry but could
Google it

#52 Emfren

Posted 16 March 2019 - 06:54 PM

View Postdaisychaon, on 15 March 2019 - 10:48 PM, said:

Ps your allerpro poo pic looks like mucus to me, your description of nappy folds sticking as well as glistening appearance and consistency look like a grumbling allergy to me. I’d get on neocate or similar instead and see if that helps. I would suspect he’s refusing it for a reason...
Just remembered too there is a rice hydrolysate formula available over the counter - that may be worth a try- can’t recall the name sorry but could
Google it

Novolac do a rice based formula

#53 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 17 March 2019 - 05:44 PM

Daisychaon thank you for your help and kind words ... really gave us a little boost there.

We have started him back on nexium for the last 3-4 days ... his overall grunting and attitude seems better but he's eating even less now and spitting up much much more.

He's down to 400ml allerpro today, last couple of days were 500ml ... we've tried every damn way of flavouring it there is. He just refuses to drink anymore than that. On breastmilk he was having around 800ml a day.

He's peeing well still i think and doesn't seem any different ... Its just we know he's capable of eating more than that and even seems hungry he just wont eat it.

Feels like we are also on the way to a feeding aversion as he just cries instantly in a cradle position no matter what ... we've had to come up with random positions to try and feed him and even that isnt working once he realises whats going on.

Not sure whether to keep up the nexium or what

#54 daisychaon

Posted 17 March 2019 - 07:03 PM

That sounds so hard you guys, really feeling for you right now.
How are his poos? Any recent pics? If he’s vomiting a lot I would be highly suspicious that the allerpro is not right and he needs either an elemental (ie neocate, elecare etc) or the novolac rice formula- ie completely dairy free. A certain percentage of CMP allergic babies can’t tolerate the extensively hydrolysed formulas and yours (like mine) may be one of them. I hate to ask, but is returning to BF an option or not?
Definitely stay on the nexium in my opinion. Untreated reflux pain will make the waters that much muddier. And make him that much more likely to develop a feeding aversion.
Weight gain??
I seriously think you guys need more support from your medicos. Have you got a mobile number for your paed? Seen an allergist or dietitian yet? Our dietitian was seriously awesome - wait list for an allergist was about 6 months from memory(!!!!?!) but dietitian saw us straight away with no referral required and she had been treating kids with non IgE allergy for years.
Keep watching hydration closely. Not sure of target volumes but if you are a long way off achieving them then you really need a medical review. I think you need a medical review anyway.
And somehow in amongst everything you are dealing with, check in with each other- are you guys okay? Watch out for PND and take care of each other

#55 daisychaon

Posted 17 March 2019 - 07:35 PM

Ps how are you giving the nexium? It can take up to 2 weeks to kick back in remember too.
I’m not sure of the formulation of nexium but we were on losec tablets- advice was to dissolve in syringe but found this nearly impossible and my GP told me to crush the tablet slightly (it says not to crush but that is the slow release granules inside, is okay to crush the binding stuff) and then drip a bit of water on it on a spoon to make a paste, scoop paste into bub’s mouth as you start to feed them. Found this heaps easier

#56 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 18 March 2019 - 09:54 AM

This was from a few days ago i think they have gotten a little better than this to.

https://imgur.com/a/pEkyj49

edit - this one is from today. https://imgur.com/a/wqIXrte

BF is to far gone ... supply isn't great now and he seems far to lazy to latch and suck.

Weight gain has been ok its slowing down but he's never lost weight. Was born 2.91kg and he's now 5.58kg almost 3 months old.

He actually had 150ml this morning at 5am perfectly, last feed was 60ml at 10pm previous night. He was happy all morning and smiling playing etc. I gave nexium around 8:30 ... started crying quite bad around 9am so i fed but only had 40ml ...
rolled around for about 20 mins in pain inconsolable until he crashed on me. He's even wimpering while asleep ..

It feels like its the nexium but i dont know whether to continue it or not ... hes improved in some aspects but seems worse in others.

We are giving 5mg morning and 5mg early arvo. Just mixing with 7.5ml of water and using syringe to give it.

Edited by Davidoff-sensei, 18 March 2019 - 11:36 AM.


#57 daisychaon

Posted 18 March 2019 - 01:21 PM

Remember that symptoms from a feed will be DELAYED- it is not an immediate hypersensitivity type allergy mediated by IgE but rather a delayed one-symptoms can take from several hours up to 3 days but will not be within an hour or 2. So what you are describing sounds classic for this type of allergy ie symptomatic 5 or so hours post the 150 ml feed at 5 am.
I would bet it is nothing to do with the Nexium- and everything to do with a partially hydrolysed formula not being the right one.
Your poo pic from today is mucus.
I am no expert but I feel strongly you need to explore neocate or similar with your paed ASAP. It is dirt cheap on an authority script. Good luck!

#58 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 18 March 2019 - 01:51 PM

View Postdaisychaon, on 18 March 2019 - 01:21 PM, said:

Remember that symptoms from a feed will be DELAYED- it is not an immediate hypersensitivity type allergy mediated by IgE but rather a delayed one-symptoms can take from several hours up to 3 days but will not be within an hour or 2. So what you are describing sounds classic for this type of allergy ie symptomatic 5 or so hours post the 150 ml feed at 5 am.
I would bet it is nothing to do with the Nexium- and everything to do with a partially hydrolysed formula not being the right one.
Your poo pic from today is mucus.
I am no expert but I feel strongly you need to explore neocate or similar with your paed ASAP. It is dirt cheap on an authority script. Good luck!

Really wow ... i thought they were better. Is it just the shinyness that shows mucus? He does drool ALOT ... is it possibly drool? We might try Novalec allergy but scared to change his formula yet again. He's prone to constipation ... won't be able to get into the paediatrician for awhile to get a prescription for neocate or something similar. Also concerned with neocate etc as i've read they taste even worse than allerpro ... he already hates that.

#59 daisychaon

Posted 18 March 2019 - 03:53 PM

Will open it up to others - what does everyone else think?

#60 Wonderstruck

Posted 18 March 2019 - 06:14 PM

I dont think it's the Nexium as sometimes there is an acid battle when they start in meds and they get a little worse before they get better.

You need more support from your doctors. Push for someone to review asap. You may need neocate or similar. They taste bad but most babies adjust or realise it doesnt hurt so they take to it well  

I'm not sure where you are located but I'd also see if you can get into a sleep school/mother and baby unit or similar as they deal with feeding issues and have nurses on around the clock - you get seen by a paed and one would.hope the round the clock nursing would pick up.on the issues.

I'm so sorry you are going through this. I've been there and it's awful when you're not getting the support you need

Edited by Wonderstruck, 19 March 2019 - 05:30 AM.


#61 Zeppelina

Posted 18 March 2019 - 09:06 PM

Oh OP, this is sounding so familiar and my heart is breaking for you because I know exactly how you are feeling. Been there, done that, and I know it's the most awful, awful feeling - the deep instinct to feed your child, but not being able to do it because nobody knows what the problem is. The second-guessing and the crying and the trying everything you can think of - different positions, etc. Our entire days were spent trying to get tiny amounts of bm or formula into her. And yep, we never went anywhere because...we just couldn't. As well as different positions, etc, we used to sing to our DD constantly because it would distract her for a minute or two, and then she'd drink a tiny bit.

It was freaking awful.

I would really, REALLY highly recommend asking your paed to try a fully amino-based formula. If that paed won't give you a script, go to another one (this is what we had to do, when our first paed flat-out refused to consider CMPI as a possibility). Ask for Alfamino - it came recommended to us by a few random parents online as being the 'best' tasting of the amino ones (apparently they are all a bit yuck, but this is the 'least' yuck). By the time we tried it, our DD had started vomiting up her feeds (this was maybe...5 weeks into the feeding issues). Within 24 hours of new formula, she'd stopped all vomiting. Within two weeks, she was drinking normal amounts and was a happy, lovely baby. For the first day or so we mixed it with regular formula for the taste, but she got used to it quickly. I honestly think as soon as she realised it didn't hurt anymore, she was happy to keep drinking it.

Oh, she was also on Nexium by this stage, too.

Can I finish by saying - you are doing amazingly. You are not failing your child - you are still here and still trying to do the best for your baby, and that is an achievement in itself when you're dealing with something like this. IT WILL GET EASIER. It really will.

Edited by Zeppelina, 18 March 2019 - 09:09 PM.


#62 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 19 March 2019 - 09:21 AM

Thanks everyone for the support and help. I just find the not knowing and the stress of it all to much sometimes.

He actually had two back to back 150ml bottles yesterday arvo at 3:30pm and 6:30pm .. he has never done that especially only 3 hours apart. In fact i dont think he's had 150ml at once in at least 2 weeks.

That really helped his daily total.

But then between that and now 9am so roughly 14 hours he's only had 90ml at 3:30am. Tried again at 6:30am but didn't want anything and is now currently asleep on me ...

I will keep pushing through till Thursday to see his weight gain for the week ... if he keeps gaining weight then im not sure why i have such a problem with him eating so little.

In the meantime i'm trying to get into our paediatrician earlier for a review and hopefully get onto something like neocate or similar.

#63 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 20 March 2019 - 08:06 AM

So yesterday we ended up in ER he was screaming from about 10am to 1pm and wouldn't eat. He'd only had the 90ml at 3:30am ...

His nappies were really low, managed to get 70ml into him at the hospital so they basically sent us home. Yesterday he ended up having 490ml formula total.

Managed to get a hold of our paediatrician and he said to up the nexium dose to 10mg morning and 5mg arvo (5mg more total a day)

Im really hesitant to be honest, since starting the nexium he has clearly gotten worse. He hasn't poo'd for 2 days and seems like he has really bad tummy pains as he's back to crunching up into a ball all the time, he's so distressed its almost like we are back 6 weeks ago.

I've read about the acid battle .. i just don't know if thats whats happening or its something else. I guess all we can do is up the dosage and see how we go ... if he gets worse we just stop?

#64 daisychaon

Posted 20 March 2019 - 11:15 AM

You poor poor things
I can only reiterate that I feel it is likely to be nothing to do with the meds and everything to do with the formula only partially treating him.
He is likely refusing feeds because he knows that the formula is making his gut hurt.
As the other poster said, her baby was a different child when they moved from partially hydrolysed to elemental.
I would ring the paed office and leave a message saying you want an elemental.
And that’s all I’m going to say about it, I don’t want to harp on and be annoying! But that is just my gut feeling.

#65 daisychaon

Posted 20 March 2019 - 11:23 AM

“Constipation” can also in my experience be a sign of allergy- if by that you mean days of not pooing- this is often a sign we have experienced especially in babyhood. No poo for several days, followed by diarrhea in our case.

#66 Ellie bean

Posted 20 March 2019 - 11:34 AM

View Postdaisychaon, on 20 March 2019 - 11:23 AM, said:

“Constipation” can also in my experience be a sign of allergy- if by that you mean days of not pooing- this is often a sign we have experienced especially in babyhood. No poo for several days, followed by diarrhea in our case.
Same here

#67 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 20 March 2019 - 11:50 AM

Thanks Daisychaon,

We are trying to get into our paed faster than our next appointment. However im not sure he can prescribe an elemental formula as i think it needs to be an allergist or GI paed now?

We have considered going onto novalec allergy purely rice based formula in the meantime to test that but again scared to switch him onto something YET again and mess him up possibly but probably worth a shot.

He has since poo'd thank god ... he's always much better after getting a poo out.

Pic (sorry) https://imgur.com/a/8ZG90ec

He has been better today ... not happy but not unhappy.

#68 Ellie bean

Posted 20 March 2019 - 11:54 AM

When my 2 were babies, a normal paed could write a script for elemental formula but only if you already had an appointment booked in (I think it didn’t matter how far ahead) with a paed gastroenterologist- but I don’t know if that’s still the case


#69 daisychaon

Posted 20 March 2019 - 11:59 AM

To me that’s still mucusy- shiny and snotty looking. Try the stretch test again with folding and unfolding nappy...
Our paed was a neonatologist and he gave us a trial tin of alfamino intially (I think they get free samples). Pretty sure paeds can prescribe- let’s see whether anyone on the forum has experience with that? Our allergist has always done the scripts for us.

#70 AdelTwins

Posted 20 March 2019 - 01:00 PM

Our paed was able to write a script for alfamino (elemental) but thankfully Pepti Jr was broken down enough to repair his bowel.

I would suggest continuing with Drs orders and wait for next paed appt. Go straight to the ER if you have more issues.

ETA - all scripts had to be approved in Canberra. So they took an extra few days to process.

Edited by AdelTwins, 20 March 2019 - 01:01 PM.


#71 Jameelah

Posted 20 March 2019 - 05:40 PM

I'm thinking it still looks possibly mucousy still too.

Personally, I would try the Novalac allergy like you were thinking of possibly doing. Our pediatrician recommended it to us and it has been great.

I know how hard it is to see your little one in such agony. I know I just wanted to do anything to help him right there and then. Just one day is too long.

You are doing a great job.

#72 Zeppelina

Posted 20 March 2019 - 10:00 PM

View PostEllie bean, on 20 March 2019 - 11:54 AM, said:

When my 2 were babies, a normal paed could write a script for elemental formula but only if you already had an appointment booked in (I think it didn’t matter how far ahead) with a paed gastroenterologist- but I don’t know if that’s still the case
Yes, same here. You just needed to have an appointment, and then the paed could prescribe it (this was about 3 years ago).

#73 Zeppelina

Posted 20 March 2019 - 10:01 PM

View Postdaisychaon, on 20 March 2019 - 11:59 AM, said:

Our paed was a neonatologist and he gave us a trial tin of alfamino intially (I think they get free samples).
Oh, actually, yes - this is how we got our first tin of Alfamino. He had both Alfamino and Neocate samples, and we took the Alfamino because multiple people had recommended it for having a 'better' taste.

#74 Davidoff-sensei

Posted 21 March 2019 - 07:20 AM

Weighed yesterday and only gained 20 grams ... that should get me into my paediatrician much faster.

CHN said his poo is definitely still mucusy and said we need a elemental formula asap.

Will call the paeds office today and see how fast i can get in ... hopefully i can get a script for something.

I'd really like to thank everyone on here for there help - its been a place for me to vent and has really helped me get through this. Sorry for the repeated questions i know it must be frustrating to read, as a first time parent i just question everything so i apologise.

I will continue to update once we visit our paediatrician :)

#75 Zeppelina

Posted 21 March 2019 - 01:23 PM

View PostDavidoff-sensei, on 21 March 2019 - 07:20 AM, said:

Will call the paeds office today and see how fast i can get in ... hopefully i can get a script for something.

I'd really like to thank everyone on here for there help - its been a place for me to vent and has really helped me get through this. Sorry for the repeated questions i know it must be frustrating to read, as a first time parent i just question everything so i apologise.

I will continue to update once we visit our paediatrician Posted Image
Please don't feel the need to apologise. You have done nothing wrong at all, you are just trying to get your child fed! We all completely understand how stressful it is, how much you feel like you're about to lose your mind with worry and uncertainty, and how you're just trying to do the 'right' thing (without having any idea of what that actually is)! Please continue to vent away in here and debrief. You are not alone in this!

So glad to hear you are getting to the paed asap. Don't let them push your concerns aside - as a first time parent, it's so hard to know what to believe, but remember that the paed is not the one with your child 24/7 - you know your baby better than anyone else, so trust your instincts that something still isn't right, and insist that they listen to you and take your concerns seriously.




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