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#26 seayork2002

Posted 08 January 2020 - 02:57 PM

View Post#notallcats, on 08 January 2020 - 02:53 PM, said:

Why are people being so obtuse?

The mother feels violated because her child has been lying/deceiving her AND someone has been in her house during the night, without her knowledge.  Her rules,respect and  privacy have been violated.

It's not a term I would use or feel, but it's not difficult to understand.

If DS lives with us then until he moves out it is his house too

Sure each member needs to consider others in the house but no I am not going to punish him because someone is there.

If I don't know an extra person is there until the morning they are not disturbing my sleep so taking them having sex aside what is the actual issue?

Edited by seayork2002, 08 January 2020 - 02:58 PM.


#27 Ruf~Feral~es

Posted 08 January 2020 - 02:57 PM

So, two teenagers were sneaking around to have sex, and got caught?  Happens all the time..... when they are forced to sneak around.  

But the language being used by the adults seems OTT.

Heartbroken
Violated
numb and gutted
still processing it
punishment
Boyfriends mother wants to know consequences on the girl
So sad for them

They are teenagers, trying to become young adults.  They need respect, boundaries and consequences - based on looking after their safety, not punishment.  

And by safety, I mean addressing the risks of sneaking out at night, STI's, emotional relationship guidance, and avoiding pregnancy.  

Punishment should not be on the table.  And the adults need to take the shock and horror reactions out of the situation.

Edited by Ruf~Feral~es, 08 January 2020 - 02:59 PM.


#28 liveworkplay

Posted 08 January 2020 - 02:58 PM

Besides the sneaking around and/ breaking rules (if there were any in place)  I am not sure what they have done to be punished for?

In 4 days I will have a 16 year old daughter and her boyfriend will still be 15 for another 2 months. I have already have many discussions with my daughter about if/when she takes her relationship to the next level, precautions and repercussions both physically and emotionally. They spend a lot of time at each others houses, some of this without adult supervision. I trust she she is prepared for when that happens.I would be really hurt and disappointed if they thought they had to sneak around but certainly not would not be punishing them.

I find the parents in this scenario over reacting or maybe getting angry for the wrong reasons?

#29 magic_marker

Posted 08 January 2020 - 02:58 PM

View Post#notallcats, on 08 January 2020 - 02:53 PM, said:

Her rules,respect and  privacy have been violated.

And security.

#30 #notallcats

Posted 08 January 2020 - 02:59 PM

The issue is the mother didn't agree or know about it.

The issue is she is upset about it.  You wouldn't be, fine.  But the thread is not about you!

@Seayork

Edited by #notallcats, 08 January 2020 - 02:59 PM.


#31 Ruf~Feral~es

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:03 PM

View Post#notallcats, on 08 January 2020 - 02:53 PM, said:

Why are people being so obtuse?

AND someone has been in her house during the night, without her knowledge.  Her rules,respect and  privacy have been violated.


No - her daughter invited a close friend into the house without telling her mother.  

We had a home-invasion a few years ago.  A total stranger smashed a door and came in and stole things, walked around whilst we were sleeping, without being invited.  That was violating.

If I invite a friend to crash at my place late at night and don't tell my kids, (or DH for that matter) - should they feel violated?

#32 born.a.girl

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:04 PM

View Postseayork2002, on 08 January 2020 - 02:21 PM, said:

I am willing to admit I am a bit old fashioned with my thinking with this BUT I don't really think punishment will do anything other than make them sneak around away from home now.

All I can suggest is the parents all calmly talk to their kids.

I gather he is 15 so under age so they could call the police technically I guess but what would that achieve?

Not in Victoria.

She would have to be more than two years older than him.

#33 liveworkplay

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:04 PM

View Post#notallcats, on 08 January 2020 - 02:59 PM, said:

The issue is the mother didn't agree or know about it.

The issue is she is upset about it.  You wouldn't be, fine.  But the thread is not about you!

@Seayork

Well the parent needs to address these issues. She needs to take the fact that sex was involved out of the equation and address why she isn't fine about it. Punishing them for having sex is only going to potentially force them into hiding more and getting themselves into potentially more dangerous situations as they get older.

I don't think my 16 year old is ready to have sex (she happens to agree) but I hope we are open enough and she is comfortable enough to talk to me about it rather then sneaking around. Her boyfriend had a sleepover at our house this week. They were in separate rooms and we had discussed this and the expectation that there would be no room hoping. There wasn't and they alll put themselves to bed (other children included) by 10pm so I was happy.

#34 magic_marker

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:05 PM

View PostRuf~Feral~es, on 08 January 2020 - 03:03 PM, said:

No - her daughter invited a close friend into the house without telling her mother.  

We had a home-invasion a few years ago.  A total stranger smashed a door and came in and stole things, walked around whilst we were sleeping, without being invited.  That was violating.

If I invite a friend to crash at my place late at night and don't tell my kids, (or DH for that matter) - should they feel violated?

Not violated.
Disrespected l think may be a better choice of words.

#35 seayork2002

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:06 PM

View Post#notallcats, on 08 January 2020 - 02:59 PM, said:

The issue is the mother didn't agree or know about it.

The issue is she is upset about it.  You wouldn't be, fine.  But the thread is not about you!

@Seayork

No but I am not sure what advice the OP is looking for then

#36 Ruf~Feral~es

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:06 PM

View Postmagicmrkeronashelf, on 08 January 2020 - 02:58 PM, said:

And security.

Really?  If she feels at risk from her daughters boyfriend, that is a whole different issue.

He didn't break in and rape the DD.  He was invited by a person living in that house.  

Yes, the mother could be annoyed at the sneaking around, lying, etc.  Angry, frustrated, disappointed. Lots of emotions might be valid.

But violated, risking her security?  Sorry, I'm still in camp OTT.

#37 born.a.girl

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:07 PM

I wonder if part of your friend's reaction is because there seems to be some blame being placed on her daughter. Wanting to know what consequences there are for the girl is pretty odd, to me.


Clearly the young couple felt unable to discuss this with either parent (not all that unusual) but I feel that's the starting point.

#38 magic_marker

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:08 PM

View PostRuf~Feral~es, on 08 January 2020 - 03:06 PM, said:

Really?  If she feels at risk from her daughters boyfriend, that is a whole different issue.

He didn't break in and rape the DD.  He was invited by a person living in that house.  

Yes, the mother could be annoyed at the sneaking around, lying, etc.  Angry, frustrated, disappointed. Lots of emotions might be valid.

But violated, risking her security?  Sorry, I'm still in camp OTT.

The 'feeling' of security for other members of the household.

#39 amdirel

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:12 PM

View Postmarple, on 08 January 2020 - 02:38 PM, said:

Mother of girl sounds odd ( I am feeling  violated)
Mother of boy sounds odd. ( What are you doing about the evil girl who led my son astray).
That's the biggest stand out for me.

Kids seem normal

Yep, this!

#40 amdirel

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:15 PM

I mean if the girl's mother wants to take issue, all she has grounds to say (IMO) is "make sure you let me know if you're inviting friends over", but that would go for all friends, day time, after school etc.

If the boy's mum wants to take issue, she can address the sneaking out of the house, but that's nothing to do with your friend anyway.

#41 eilca

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:19 PM

Yes teens have sex. No shocks there. But to be unaware of the lad entering and leaving is a shock that foes raise safety issues. The word violated may not seems logical for some of us, but I get it.  Trust, respect and safety have been breached.



#42 Ruf~Feral~es

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:20 PM

View Postmagicmrkeronashelf, on 08 January 2020 - 03:08 PM, said:

The 'feeling' of security for other members of the household.

Yeah, still not getting it.  If this 15 year old boy is the type to put people's security at risk, then he shouldn't be in the house at all.  Is it a risk of stealing things, hurting people?  Targeting younger children?

If it is just the issue that he was in the house without the mothers permission, that is a respect and a sneaking around issue, as previously mentioned.  I don't think it is risking the house occupants security?

And he was invited in.  He didn't break in uninvited.

ETA - I think language has the power to escalate the situation into something that it doesn't need to be, ultimately making these teenagers feel like criminals, when really, they just made some bad / silly decisions.

Edited by Ruf~Feral~es, 08 January 2020 - 03:22 PM.


#43 Dadto2

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:24 PM

d

Edited by Dadto2, 08 January 2020 - 03:43 PM.


#44 Kirralee2015

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:30 PM

View Post#notallcats, on 08 January 2020 - 02:53 PM, said:

Why are people being so obtuse?

The mother feels violated because her child has been lying/deceiving her AND someone has been in her house during the night, without her knowledge.  Her rules,respect and  privacy have been violated.

It's not a term I would use or feel, but it's not difficult to understand.

Thank you, that's it exactly. You have explained it so much better than I did or could have.

#45 eilca

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:32 PM

View PostRuf~Feral~es, on 08 January 2020 - 03:20 PM, said:



Yeah, still not getting it.  If this 15 year old boy is the type to put people's security at risk, then he shouldn't be in the house at all.  Is it a risk of stealing things, hurting people?  Targeting younger children?    

If it is just the issue that he was in the house without the mothers permission, that is a respect and a sneaking around issue, as previously mentioned.  I don't think it is risking the house occupants security?

And he was invited in.  He didn't break in uninvited.

ETA - I think language has the power to escalate the situation into something that it doesn't need to be, ultimately making these teenagers feel like criminals, when really, they just made some bad / silly decisions.

I think sex is a normal function and have no problems with the idea of teens having sex. But I do think a parent has the right to know who is in the house. And I do think a parent has the right to stop the teens having sex in the house if they are against it.  It's not about shaming the teens, more about parents feeling comfortable about decisions of who is in the house at any given time.

#46 Jingleflea

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:33 PM

Are they ninjas that they managed to not get caught by the people living in the house?

No creaking floorboards(or bedsprings)? No sex noises? No giggles or sneezes or toilet trips?

#47 seayork2002

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:35 PM

View Posteilca, on 08 January 2020 - 03:32 PM, said:

I think sex is a normal function and have no problems with the idea of teens having sex. But I do think a parent has the right to know who is in the house. And I do think a parent has the right to stop the teens having sex in the house if they are against it.  It's not about shaming the teens, more about parents feeling comfortable about decisions of who is in the house at any given time.

So the BF sneaks out to the GF's house, the law is laid down 'this has to stop' are they going to say to each other 'hhmmm we can't have sex anymore here' or are they going to both sneak off and do it is random places or his place or wherever?

#48 Dadto2

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:37 PM

d

Edited by Dadto2, 08 January 2020 - 03:43 PM.


#49 Dadto2

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:39 PM

View Posteilca, on 08 January 2020 - 03:32 PM, said:

I think sex is a normal function and have no problems with the idea of teens having sex. But I do think a parent has the right to know who is in the house. And I do think a parent has the right to stop the teens having sex in the house if they are against it.  It's not about shaming the teens, more about parents feeling comfortable about decisions of who is in the house at any given time.

I don't think anyone disagrees with you, it's the reaction of the mother that I don't agree with it, grounding of the son etc

#50 Kirralee2015

Posted 08 January 2020 - 03:39 PM

Thank you everyone for all your replies.

I have used my girlfriend's words in my OP.  That's how she feels, I will not dismiss those feelings but I hope your responses give her a different perspective.

The having of consensual, safe sex is not the issue, it is very much the sneaking around, the lack of respect and betrayal of trust, having someone entering her house in the middle of the night unbeknown to her, the potential dangers of the boyfriend being out and about at that time - the list of what upsets both parents goes on.  I haven't been in their shoes, nor have I done what the children have done, it's all new ground to me.  I have no idea what, if any punishment, I would dole out.

Thank you again for your perspectives.




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