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Non-vaccinated kids discussion #2
97 replies to this topic
Posted 02 December 2006 - 03:33 PM
Thought I'd better do a second thread for you seeing as the previous one is 100 replies
Here's a link to the previous discussion
Please note: This thread is a supportive thread for people choosing not to vaccinate. There are many other areas of EB for people with opposing opinions to discuss them, so I would ask that this thread stays a supportive one. If you have any issues about this, please PM me.
Posted 02 December 2006 - 03:41 PM
thanks Chelli - thats great!!!
Woohoo... another thread... look out!
Just wanted to pop in and add to the newest thread - speak soon!
Posted 26 December 2006 - 10:43 AM
I'm just lurking a little to read some of your opinions. I vaccinate, so I'm not qualified to be in here.
Just a little comment to MrsLittleBear on your childs eczema. Our DD1 had bad eczema and we went to a specialist. The most valuable things we have learnt did not include the cortisone cream (which we do chose to use) but it was finding out what she was allergic to. So if they do get any worse you could always see a specialist (if you want) but just walk away with which ever bits of info you want from it.
We also found different products at a health shop, not sure of their ingredients though. PM me if you want me to look up what we've got.
Posted 11 January 2007 - 10:42 AM
Hi all and happy new year!
mum of twins - to not allow a child into school to access education based on medical and health choices is illegal and considered descrimination. When push comes to shove they dont have a leg to stand on, their policy is just social pressure but cannot be enforced.
mum of twins - in regards to questions about "herd immunisation" you can check out the last thread as we discussed that.
will be back later as I have to get DS off to school
Posted 11 January 2007 - 01:03 PM
If children are not vaccinated, they should NOT be allow to attend school or daycare unless there is a medically sanctioned reason to either eliminate or delay the vaccinations (i.e. allergies, previous reactions, family history, etc.)
Just because you don't think it's "right" for your family places your children under totally unnecessary risk and also risk exposure to young babies and vulnerable adults.
Natural therapies are NOT going to protect your children against menC, pneumococcus, chicken pox, etc.
Maybe if some of you had a discussion with my paediatrician who has seen children die or go blind/disabled from preventable childhood illnesses, you might see the light.
My child, who is immune deficient, could have died having been exposed to non-vaccinated children prior to his 2 month shots.
Very selfish decision IMHO.
Posted 11 January 2007 - 01:21 PM
This thread is a supportive thread for people choosing not to vaccinate. There are many other areas of EB for people with opposing opinions to discuss them, so I would ask that this thread stays a supportive one. If you have any issues about this, please PM me.
HeidiH, perhaps you missed the above from the mod in her first post, this is not an area to debate whether or not a non vaxxed child is a risk, is risking other children or if the parents are selfish, if you would like to discuss that please trot off to WDYT and start a new discussion on it.. anyways...
Hello, I am another non vaxxer, great to see a thread where we can support one another.
Posted 11 January 2007 - 03:05 PM
Ive just spent ages reading through these threads and thought I'd pop my head in to say Hi.
I'm another one who has chosen not to vaccinate.Whether we do in the future remains to be seen, but for the time being, we are happy with our choice. Braden has had the Vitamin K injection at birth(I'm a RH Negative),and we refused the Hep B at the hospital.
A little on my history......
Braden is the result of 2 1/2 years of trying on IVF, with 5 M/C's(one being twins at 18 &19.7 weeks ), and numerous chemical pregs.
He was the result of our last Frozen Embryo after 9 very hard cycles.(we were about to give up IVF and then our miracle arrived)
My DH and I researched everything we could find on the pro's and con's of vaccinating, and after a weighing everything up, we made the decision not to Vaccinate.
Our reasons being, that Braden is the most precious, long sought after love of our lives, and we are not willing to take any risks with immunisations(especially at a very early age). A babies immune system dosent "mature" til at the very earliest 18 months, and in our opinion, injecting chemicals with goodness knows what in them into his little body is crazy.
We have had health proffessionals trying to encourage us to get him immunised, but all they care about is getting money into their hot hands. They wouldnt care 2 hoots if our son reacted to any of the needles.We are strong enough and well informed enough to tell them to back off.Its our decision, not theirs.
Braden isnt in kinder as yet, so i havent come across any negatives as far as being around other kiddies is concerned.
I also have the opinion that if other kids are immunised, why is there such a big fear of those that arnt? Does that mean they are not confident enough to not be worried??
And also, when people say"if your child is immunised against Chickenpox"(for example)they wont get a severe case of it.How do they know? and how do they know that if their child wasn't immunised that they would?? Each child is different, so your not really going to know if they have a severe reaction or not IYKWIM??
Just wanted to add also-(sorry, this post is getting too long)
Braden is very bright for a 26 month old. He can count to 10 properly(in any order) ,knows the whole alphabet,Knows just about every Thomas the Tank character(even the ones we dont really talk about)knows what traffic lights do, and tells us when to goooooooo.Recognises shops we go to, and wants to visit them. Remembers people names and will say them days later just out of the blue, and heaps more.... I wonder if any of this is a contributing factor in him not being immunised, therefor not being "delayed" in any way. (just a thought)
Anyways.....hello again to everyone, I will keep an eye out on this thread and try to contribute regulary.
Luv Bek x
Posted 18 January 2007 - 06:13 AM
Saw this thread and just had to add my two cents. When DS1 was born I was one of those bores who used to lecture all those non-vaccinating mums about how irresponsible they were not to vaccinate their children blah blah blah so naturally DS1 had everything on the schedule and whatever else was on offer (ie chickenpox and meningococcal). So now DS1 is severely autistic. The more I researched the whole cause of autism thing the more I became alarmed at how often vaccinations MAY play a part in those children who for some reason are more susceptible to autism and who may have just been tipped over the edge by one or more vaccinations. The MMR was the one that kept popping up when it came to what was the straw that broke camel's back. Anyway, DS2 came along and since I thought it was the MMR shot that may have caused DS1's problems, DS2 has only been vaccinated up to his six months - so no MMR shot. Now it seems he may have a bit of autism as well (but so far too young for an official diagnosis). Seems now it's also the Hep B vaccine given at birth that sets these vulnerable kids off. I'm not saying all kids who are given these vaccinations will become autistic, just that if you have any family history of autism or ADD/ADHD, or other developmental problems then do your research before making the decision to vaccinate.
Posted 18 January 2007 - 10:08 AM
stelvin - I found your post very interesting, sorry to hear about your DS's autism. I think what struck me the most was
I was one of those bores who used to lecture all those non-vaccinating mums about how irresponsible they were not to vaccinate their children blah blah blahBecause it seems those that do tend to lecture are coming from a very one sided view. You have managed to gain more knowledge now, and like most knowledge gained it often humbles our sometimes staunch opinions. Will you continue to vaccinate?
I know its a bit of chance either way isnt it? I mean you could have had your very pro-vaccination opinion, gone ahead and vaccinated your kids and nothing come of it. I guess you found out the hard way that vaccinations are not cut and dry.
Its a constant revolving decision for me, not that I plan of vaccinating any time soon. But constantly educating myself and re-evaluating my decision.
I also have the opinion that if other kids are immunised, why is there such a big fear of those that arnt? Does that mean they are not confident enough to not be worried??I never get that either, surely they should safe as safe with a fully vaccinated child? Yet there is such a fear of the non-vaccinated???????
I too cannot in good concious inject my child with the chemicals and toxins of vaccines knowing what is in them...
I believe that part of ds difficulties are due (in part) to vaccination and have chosen not to continue at the moment.what difficulties does your DS have?
You are right, many people have many good reasons not to vaccinate... I wish people would be more aware of this. I find those that dont vaccinate or do so selectively tend to have more knowledge around the subject than those who do.
will post more later, running late....
Posted 09 February 2007 - 05:36 PM
~purplebee~ It is amazing isnt how others can be so single minded about it all without even considering the other side. Well... its not a discussion or "debate" I go into as not matter what in life you are not going to change other peoples opinions or what they have been told but take on their valid points - but very rarely do I get the same consideration in return <_<
This whole issue seems to coming up alot for me again lately, which is good as I am always open to revisiting my decision and being open to new info and advice. Although more often than not it simple resolves me decision NOT to vaccinate.
With my baby due in 5 weeks I am sure the whole thing will come up during my hospital stay but a friend who recently gave birth at the same hospital, same docs etc was quite pleasantly surpised at thier acceptance of her decision not to vaccinate.
When I gave birth to DS at the Royal womans in Sydney I was almost harrassed about the whole thing and if I had not had resolve I would have really been pushed into it. Honestly, you would think that people/staff would have more respect!! <_<
I find here though that the doctors are more open and respectful in the private hospital, and doctors who have multiple degree from Asia, usa and UK seem more educated and seem to have a broader view as well as treating so many different cultures and therefore are so are used to everyone doing things differently.
I am sure it would be different for the locals in the public system though!
Maybe its a bit about me too though! As in.... at first when I decided not to vaccinate people/docs etc were more confrontational with me and tried to talk me out of it, which I think had to do with my uncertainty. Now that I have made a firm decision, all the doctors and practicioners I have seen have been very accepting and understanding - go figure!
Posted 23 February 2007 - 09:48 AM
I have been reading through everyones comments & thought I would try to join in.
I am a mum who has done all injections so far (12months) - previous to doing them I was on the fence about it, didn't really want to have them done but felt alot of pressure from outsiders about doing it.
Everytime Chad has an injection he ends up sick for a least 5 days - last time high temps & a bad cough.
He is meant to have the cpox done soon but I really don't think I will have it done.
I am still so unsure
Any advise would be appreciated.
Posted 23 February 2007 - 03:47 PM
Hi chads mum,
what specific advice are you after??
A friend of mine had her kids done for the chicken poxs and they still got it???
It doesnt sound like Chad's body copes at all well with having vaccinations - what has your doctor said?
Its good you are looking more into it and I am sure with the armed with the right info you will feel more comfortable about your decision either way!
Posted 24 February 2007 - 08:45 AM
Hi Bek and welcome!
I am really curious on something you said earlier -
Braden has had the Vitamin K injection at birth(I'm a RH Negative),
I'm wondering what they have to do with each other? (Serious question) I am also RH- and when Emma was born 6 months ago she didn't have the Vitamin K needle. I talked to my GP and midwife and both were fine with this. Is there something I should know??
Posted 24 February 2007 - 10:18 AM
I just double checked with DH, and he assures me that the Vitamin K injection has nothing to do with being RH negative.
Its just basically a vitamin injection given at bith.
Im such a cluts Sorry for worrying you.
Luv Bek x
Posted 24 February 2007 - 12:04 PM
I guess what I am asking is "why have the injection if you can still catch c/pox?
Chads dr said he should have all his injections - the Health Nurse on the other hand says different.
Me..... such a big decision, I wonder if I have to think twice then maybe don't go ahead???
Posted 24 February 2007 - 06:56 PM
G'day, Just wanted to pop in and say hi.
We vaxed or first dd all but the MMR, second one has had nothing. My first DD is at kinder, and the forms asked to see the yellow book and show that they are up to date. I took along my conscientious objectors form instead (that was doen to get the 18 month payment for Centrelink) and they copied it and looked at me fairly horrified. But that is ALL they can do. I already know from my MCHN that if there is an outbreak of an infectious disease that I will be notified and my child sent home. Fine with me. I expect school will be similar. Like another said, legally they can not refuse entry to a child on a 'health' basis.
Just thought this might help other mums who are approaching this time. Hang on to those conscientous objector forms if you get them, they are used later for 'proof' or really for others to feel that they have met their obligations (in terms of seeing bits of paper!).
Posted 25 February 2007 - 08:02 AM
DD1 and DD2 are at pre-school/school. They were both vaxed to 6 months and nothing after. Interestingly the school they attend had no problem. In fact, the person who took the enrolment forms didn't even know what some of the vaccinations were on the form and said "Don't worry, no one even looks at these"
Posted 25 February 2007 - 09:54 PM
chadsmum - you really have to make the decision yourself based on what you think is best! No one can really tell you, but maybe go back and talk to the health nurse and listen to what she has to say about why not to get all the vaccinations. Sounds like you know plenty of reasons why you should from your doctor and now you need to balance that info out.
I wonder if I have to think twice then maybe don't go ahead???Maybe dont go ahead until you have reached a conclusive desision! Like anything, you dont want to go into it with doubts!
Obviously my opinion would be to stop vaccinations especially if his reactions have been less than ideal, but as I said, that would be my opinion and my choice for my children.
rachelP - interesting what you have to say... its amazing that society just cant cope without documentation. Good idea to keep a copy of the concientous form handy!
~kylie~ makes you wonder doesnt it? Why they go to the bother of all that paper work if no one really is taking notice?
Has anyones children had any of the diseases that they are not vaccinated for? Mumps, measles etc?
One of the boys in my mothers group got german measles and was only sick for 3 days with a slight temp and a mild rash (mind you he had just been vaccinated <_< )
DS has been exposed to chicken pox but didnt get it!
Posted 26 February 2007 - 12:50 PM
I haven't posted for ages, but I did in the initial threads that were started up. Ella still has had no vaccinations, and I don't plan for her to have any.
As far as the legalities go with refusal to child care etc, I thought this was all fairly concrete, that they legally couldn't refuse entry based on immunisation status. WELL! I am in the middle of a case with the Human Rights & Equal Opportunities Commission (through Commonwealth department, not State) as Ella was refused entry to a centre in October. Human Rights have said that I do have a case and they have contacted the centre for an explanation. I should get some sort of notification soon as their deadline to respond was 24th Feb I think. I don't want to send Ella to that Centre anymore, but I want their policy changed so that other children are not refused entry. I just couldn't believe it.
Has anyone else had any experience with this? I have contacted someone who had a case similar to mine in the 90's and he has been pretty helpful although we have sort of lost contact over the last few weeks.
I will let you know how things go!
Posted 26 February 2007 - 01:15 PM
MrsLittlebear - wow!! Really???? They obviously CANT do that and I am glad you have a case and are following it through! Keep us updated for sure!
Like you said you dont want Ella to go there anymore but its good that they dont get away with blatant discrimination - they should know better!
I have had a few friends that have had similar issues but when push has come to shove the school/care facility has realised they dont really have a leg to stand on - sounds like someone is really digging their heels in on this one not realising they are actually not the ones in the right and its not policy they can have nor enforce.
Good luck and keep us updated!
Posted 26 February 2007 - 02:43 PM
Just a quick q - not quite non-vacc but on a similar theme. Has anyone tried to get individual shots (at different time periods) instead of the MMR (eg measles at 2, mumps at 4, rubella later on)? I know it's available overseas, but haven't had any luck finding info on Australian availability. Any suggestions??
Posted 27 February 2007 - 08:34 AM
Mrs Little Bear - contact the australian vaccination network
www.avn.org.au and they will be able to help you with all sorts of stuff and especially getting the centre to change their policy.
I am due to have number 1 in a couple of weeks and will not be vaccinating. My DH is a chiropractor and we treat a number of children with vaccination injuries so there is no way I would let them do that to my baby. We will be using homeopathics instead. Interesting with myself I had measles at 3 months, was then immunised and then got it again at 2 years. A girlfriend of mine whose kids went through a whopping cough epidemic a couple of years ago, no 1 who was vaccinated got it, the only child out of a group of 20 kids who did not get it was no 2 who was the only child not vaccinated.
Glad there is somewhere on EB for support.
Hi Trilby and thanks for sending me this way.
Posted 27 February 2007 - 12:13 PM
Thanks Colleen, I will contact avn. I have contacted VISA (Vaccination Information of South Australia) who I am a Member of, but haven't contacted AVN. Will do that now.
Posted 27 February 2007 - 12:28 PM
I read in a copy of Informed Voice that it was not possible in Australia to have the immunisations seperately (MMR for example).
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