[Hat-trick]

Hi, I'm a dad of 3 kids, the newest an 8 week old girl who refuses to sleep. We had problems from the start with feeding etc. Mum's milk didn't come through right away. Bub's body rejected formula. Mum & bub spent the majority of the 1st 3 weeks in hospital due to baby not growing & then the cesarean wound got infected & then she got a UTI (urinary track infection).

Anyhow we haven't been able to get bub into a proper routine yet. We've tried EVERYTHING. We're trying to feed measured amounts every 3 hrs daytime & 4 hrs night time but baby has other ideas & is the most stubborn thing I'v seen (like her mum lol). She only eats when she wants & sleeps when she wants but this seems to be quick feeds whereby she falls asleep on the breast & refuses to wake no matter what we do, yet ironically will wake suddenly from the sound of a sparrow's fart 30mins later. We're at our wits end with this. She will wake & cry, & cry, & cry & only stops if we hold her & even when she falls asleep in our arms she will wake as soon as we put her down. I'm totally against holding babies all the time. My other 2 kids (from previous marriage) were great sleepers & eaters. This 1 requires total darkness & dead silence & that's still not enough.

I should mention this little bub is a reflux baby, which we mostly have under control now with gripe water & stomach calm. But, all this aside she's also a clever little thing too. For example she looked me in the eye with an expression of spite & repeatedly spat her dummy out yesterday. She also looks up every few seconds while holding her to make sure she's still being held & if not, she cries.

Child health nurse said she shouldn't be awake for any more than 1 & 1/2 hrs after feeding but we just can't get her to comply.

I'll probably get flamed for this but if I had my way I'd let her work herself up so badly that she had no choice but to fall asleep however mummy is very much 1 to feel sorry for everything on this earth & won't/can't let that happen. I remember doing this with the other 2 kids too & they slept well after that. You only have to do it once. So besides this does anyone have any ideas because we're so tired & stressed out over this?

Please HELP!!!!

[ImpatientAnna]

Your DD is 8 weeks old, she isn't meant to be in a routine! She is a newborn! Newborns don't look at anyone with spite! They don't have that complicated a pattern of thinking. All they know is that they are uncomfortable (hungry, tired or dirty) and they scream because it is all they know how to do.

If your 2 others were great at eating and sleeping consider it good luck and this baby is different (and completely normal). All babies are different and have a wide range of normal. My baby was held to sleep for a few months too. You need to give them what they need because they are a helpless newborn. They are not trying to manipulate and spite you.

You sound like you are at your wits end so I will offer some advice before I have a nark, but don't fight how this little baby is, if your baby likes being held to sleep, invest in a hug a bub for day naps (sleeping upright will help the reflux), side car the cot to your bed and feed baby to sleep with a towel rolled up and put under the head end of the mattress to help the reflux). Don't worry about creating poor sleep associations, they don't learn them until 6 months. She will grow out of the fussiness soon enough.

Letting a tiny baby scream to sleep is cruel and most believe to be psychologically damaging. Even people who believe in controlled crying don't do it until 6-12months.

You also don't sound as though you are very connected to your baby - may I suggest spending some time bonding eg get a hug a bub and take baby for walks to give mum a break and allow you to bond. You also sound as though you could be suffering from PND (men get it too), maybe see a gp if you are not coping. How is your wife managing?

[ImpatientAnna]

PS also measured/timed feeds are the worst thing you can possibly do for a woman's milk supply. It works on a principle of supply and demand. On a baby that young just let baby go for it whenever she wants and it will keep the mums supply up and baby's tummy filled and less screaming for you to endure!!!!

[peking homunculu...]

Impatient Anna has great advice. Baby is cryong because she is not happy not because she is being difficult. Feed on demand and get a baby carrier for her to sleep in during the day. Sounds like she needs to be held and close in order to sleep.

My first would sleep brilliantly as long as she had physical contact.

[EBeditor]

Hi there,

This link may help - it explains that the peak of crying and fussiness is about 8 weeks
http://www.purplecrying.info/sections/inde...=2&sctpg=10

All babies are different so while your first children may have settled more easily your third may have more difficulty. Perhaps it's worth taking your bub to the GP for a check up and possible trial of reflux medication?

You and your wife also need to try to be kind to eachother and and stay solid while you get through this difficult period. Babies can be so exhausting.

In any case crying it out is not recommended for babies this young, if at all. All her cries should be responded to.

[raone]

Don't know if this will help. Mum might already be doing it. But when my DS is going to sleep on breast and only snacking I do this. Every time she shuts her eyes and stop sucking rub the back of your finger along her chin down her throat (softly). It encourages DS to suck more and wake up. If that isn't working I will gently start to pull breast out of mouth. If he is still half awake he will start sucking and again and wake up.

Feed on demand also DD will get into her own routine if you allow her to.

[belinda1976]

I would suggest White Noise for sleeps - worked a treat with my kids.

[crackles]

Sounds like our DD1 when she was born!

Is it ur wife's first baby? Maybe she's still figuring out how things work and gets stressed easily which transfers to the baby (this was me). Also feed on demand as pp have said. During the day for sleeps sometimes the only thing u can do is have Bub in a sling/pouch while u walk around doing whatever u need to do.
Have u tried rocking Bub to sleep in a pram?
I used to dread bed time (evening) because like ur Bub, DD would wake up as soon as we put her down. It often took a few goes before she actually stayed asleep and then she was up every 2-3 hrs anyway! She also had to have it dead quiet.
Our DD didn't take to the dummy either.
At 9 months we finally had enough of the night waking/putting down so we did control crying just the once and that was it. 8 weeks is a bit young for that tho.

Sorry not much help but others have been there and survived! Just try and make the atmosphere around the home as relaxed as possible. Remember u r all still learning/relearning the newborn thing and issues will iron out with time and patience (supplies get very low I know!)

Ur Bub could also be having a growth spurt about now which won't help matters!

Hang in there!

[PurpleNess]

Firstly forget any sort of routine for such a young baby! All baby needs & wants is to be close to mum, so firstly I'd suggest a sling or Ergo type baby carrier.

Also Try a different formula or continue to get mum BF assistance from a Lactation consultant. MY DS was like this when he was hungry, my supply wasn't good & we ended up comp feeding with formula.

Babies that young shut down when left to cry due to high levels of a stress hormone so I'd suggest it is NOT the solution here, just imagine how vulnerable your baby is feeling....

Your baby is not stubborn, spiteful or any of the other things you suggest, she is an 8 week old baby, please don't forget that, she has no concept of such things, just the basic of needs.

Check out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nv3-74EFtWQ

It might help you & your wife to understand what it is that baby actually wants/needs.

[Matthias' mum]

Wow... Looking at you with spite? Really?? Babies that age aren't capable of that sort of complex thought.
It sounds to me as if she needs to be held and fed more frequently. Lots of babies don't adhere to a feeding schedule, especially in the afternoon/evening, when they want to feed more frequently. If she has reflux, she will benefit from being upright after feeds, so I'd invest in a good baby carrier like a hug a bub or an ergo. Put her in that after a feed, and go about your day and she will quite likely fall asleep. Better sleep during the day will probably help at night. Lots of babies with reflux also want to comfort suck, so you could try a dummy again. I think the cherry teat ones are better then the orthodontic ones.
I know you said you don't believe in holding babies too often, but touch is actually a physical need for babies, and some need more then others. Babies that are held or carried a lot are often more settled and cry less, even when they aren't being held. Have a look at the dr sears website for more info about it. Try not to think of it as spoiling the baby, think of it as fulfilling a real need that babies have for affection. As she gets older, she will want to play and be more independent, so don't worry about creating bad habits, she will grow out of needing to be held all the time.
Lastly, all babies are different. What worked with your last two children may not work this time. It obviously sounds like using schedules and not picking her up too often isn't working, so why not try something different?